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MRo ROLLINS" Ivfr" President, wouldn"t it b\~ rather presumpt.uous 011\ our part to try t,~ say what anyone Stare, is entitled to until som~ formula ha,s been devised which will In'ovid", al'!\ equitable division, as near as can be detelC'lnined. For <,xample, Mr. President, you said New Mexico has x'cceived t.hrough other sources the.5% to whhh they are entitled. How do we kncJ'w, in the final analysis, but that they may be given more than 50/0. '-. CHAIRMAN; Any increase in New Mexico will mean cutting down some other State. If they provide 5% of the water in the stream, it doesn't look fair that they should draw out more than that because it would have to be at the expen!!e of some other State. MR. ROLLINS: If you hold to that idea exclusively, how much water would Ca1i~ornia and Arizona be entitled to "/ CHAIRMANg That's under the compact. and absolutely apart from the division of the water in the Upper Basin States 0 They beat us to that and they have the Colorado Compact drawn up, and it is legislation, and we can't say anything about that. The difficulty is, just as I say, if they would allocate to us more than 1 S%, we couldn't get it up there in the State anyway, MR, ROLLINS; The point I wish to make is, until the Upper Basin States have sat around the table, as in the Boulder Canyon Act, and make the compact, we won't know whether New Mexico is to get 5% or 15%, or Colorado 35 or 45% -,~no way of knowing. . CHAIRMANg The Green River Basin country says that the first thing to alloaate is the debt. How is each State going to pay on the debt at Lee Ferry. and after that, anyone of the States will be perfectly willing to allow any other State to have the excess, I mean the main thing is going to be to pay this debt, and that ought to be settled first before you divide the water. Pay your debts, and then you,can divide the liqu.id assets, MR. ROLI..INSg That's not the way Congress is working, MR. SANDBERG: Mr. President, hasn't the time been set when the Upper Division is to get together and determine the allocation? CHAIRMAN; How many meetings have they had, Melvin? MR. ROLLINS: They had about three general meetings and, of course, the committees have been m.eeting frequently, particularly the Engineering Committee, I can't say how many meetings they held, CHAIRMAN: I'll say the whole bone of contention is, they are afraid to say how much we are going to pay at Lee Ferry, When that's settled, why you have settled the question of the division of water, ..3'1~